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BMS-News News about the BMS project

April 2022, reviving the project

There have been some reasons why this project became stalled for a while. One of them was that the prototype was just working too well, there was no urgent need for continuing on this project. I got busy and distracted by a lot of other things that came up.

Things have changed though: our power consumption went steadily up, we are now also cooking full time on electricity and we need to upgrade our system somewhat with more lithium capacity. With the planned installation of an additional lithium battery bank, I have to build a new prototype and change the other one so they can cooperate on managing our power storage together. Instead of building yet another prototype I decided to finalize the design and organize a small production run for some professionally made Printed Circuit Boards.

In the mean time we have had lots of opportunity to talk with other cruisers and listen to their experiences and needs. This is what we learned so far:

  • Some people liked the idea of the BMS, but really didn't want to have a lead acid battery anymore in their system. I still believe that having at least some lead acid capacity makes it a lot more easier to control charge sources and that it makes the system more robust and fault tolerant, but ok, if that is what people want, the BMS should at least be able to work in a "no lead acid" mode.

  • We learned from our own situation that there always comes a moment where you want to upgrade your system. So the BMS topology should be extensible. One should be able to add more lithium capacity later on and instead of mixing "old" and "new" (possible different) cells into one battery bank, it is better to maintain two separate banks. Still though, you don't want to have two independent BMS fighting over when the solar charger needs to be shut down, there should be only one master controlling multiple "bank slaves".

  • We also learned that people want to buy large lithium banks, despite our warning that you should use lithium only for "short term storage" and use lead acid for "long term storage". We have to admit that we are also moving into that direction, to increase our lithium storage and use lead-acid only for buffering and with less reserve for long term storage. It is however still true that long term storage damages lithium batteries, and the only way to prevent that is to charge them to a partial charge only, like 80% max. The problem here is that due to the flat voltage curve of lithium batteries you can't see what "80%" is unless you once in a while charge up until you see the voltage increase (which indicates 100%), and start precisely counting all the amps going in and out to keep track of the 80%-spot. To my knowledge, so far no other BMS can do that reliably.

  • If the battery is full (or hits the 80% target), the charging needs to be terminated. Until now this is done by taking the lithium battery offline (which is why at least some lead-acid battery buffer capacity is needed). But I'm working now on some code to dynamically adjust the voltage of the popular Morningstar MPPT chargers so that they still power the ship but 0 amps are going in and out of the lithium batteries. And no, this is not going to work if you set a "fixed" charging voltage, it can only work if it is done dynamically.

  • We met some people that had problems with their lithium batteries. Always it was due to a failure of their (third party) BMS (or lack of a BMS at all). These things are often derived from a BMS which was originally developed to maintain the batteries of cordless drills or e-bikes. They are in no way up to the complex task of maintaining a big battery that is not either being charged or being discharged, but where charging and discharging alternate frequently (clouds blocking the sun, heavy loads switching on) without reaching one of the endpoints "full" or "empty" undisturbed. Some BMS simply broke down (boat life is harsh for sensitive electronics), wires came loose, and due to the lack of redundancy, there is no fault indication and the user has no way to know that his batteries are no longer protected against over(dis)charging. Dangerous!

  • We also learned that BMS are particularly sensitive to nearby lightning strikes and SSB transmissions. There are a lot of wires to be connected to a BMS, and all these wires work like little antenna's. Combined with the sensitivity required to measure small cell voltages and currents, it is no surprise that it creates havoc. In my BMS design I took a lot of measures to make the system insensitive to EMI (ElectroMagnetic Interference). Most BMS are not designed with EMI insensitivity in mind because it adds to the cost, and after all for cordless drills and e-bikes you don't have to worry too much about these kind of things.

  • Our own experience is that despite having a nice status "webpage" in the WiFi accessible BMS, on board ZwerfCat we heard too many times "It is a sunny day. How are we doing with the batteries? Can I run the washing machine and still have enough juice for the oven?". Sure, we can go to the LCD or take our laptop or mobile phone and have a quick look onto the integrated webpage, but actually it would be nice if we would get an automated verbal update once in a while, something like "Ding! Battery state of charge just passed the 80% mark". It would signal us that it is a good time to start running the watermaker, washing machine or some other "manual" load. So that is going to be an option too.

  • I also had an independent project where I automatically switch on the warm water boiler as soon as the batteries are fully charged and solar power is still available. It would be nice if this could be controlled by the BMS instead. So it should have some configurable automatic switch outputs as well and guess what, it became part of the new design because it fits so well into "battery management" or "power management".

Design changes

The new design is focused on :

  • Modularity, flexibility and extensibility
  • Redundancy
  • Easy of installation, maintenance and daily use
  • Low power use

In the new design the BMS is divided into networked modules, connected by a standard Cat5 network cable. I have thought about making this network wireless, but that would make the system less robust, more difficult to configure, and would use way more electrical power. None of the components of the BMS are "portable" and one has to run a couple of wires anyway, so it makes actually no sense to accept these disadvantages just to save connecting a few more wires. A wireless "bridge" module is still an option though if you really don't want to run a piece of cable.

The system is designed in such a way that failure of one module (or disconnecting it, resetting, or updating) will not result in a loss of lithium battery protection. Both the master module and the battery module are safeguarding the lithium battery, so two independent processors are protecting your batteries and system. Also, the modules are locally fed and don't share a common ground. This makes the system more robust against ground loops, EMI (SSB) problems, or induction peaks due to nearby lightning strikes.

Let's discuss the most important modules:

Master module

This module, built around a powerful ESP32 processor, is responsible for making all strategic power management decisions. It can be installed in a convenient user accessible place away from the batteries. It performs the following tasks:

  • Powering the "network" bus
  • Communication with:
    • the client modules
    • UDP/TCP clients
    • the users (integrated website, LCD, acoustic alarm)
    • NMEA2000
    • Serial devices
  • Maintaining copies of battery status
  • Controlling battery connection states
  • Controlling cell balancing
  • Controlling chargers
  • Controlling 1 external load
  • Reporting
  • System configuration
  • System upgrades ("over the air")

Lithium battery module

This module is to be installed next to the actual battery bank. There can be more of these modules if you have multiple independent battery banks.

This module, built around an "Arduino" ATMega168 processor, deals with everything related to a lithium battery bank. There can be 12V, 24V and "cheap" versions of this module. Although all battery related decisions are made by the master module, it can safeguard the battery on its own if the master module is not available, thus adding redundancy to the system.

These modules perform the following tasks:

  • Measuring and reporting individual cell voltages
  • Measuring and reporting battery current and local bus voltage
  • Measuring transfer losses
  • Measuring temperatures
  • Measuring its own current consumption
  • Tracking battery SoC
  • Balancing of the cells
  • Watchdog, safe battery shutdown if master module fails
  • Controlling (and timing) of (bi-stable) battery relais
  • Controlling of local cooling fan, battery heater, or load
  • Shutting down local components after battery shut-down

The actual "BMS chip" is not some Chinese "e-bike BMS" but a LTC6810 (LTC6811 for the 24V version), the same chip used for Tesla's and other "high power high reliability" applications. These IC's are very high quality, high precision, and have extensive internal diagnostic, fault detection and built-in redundancy, and will even detect broken wires.

For high precision current measurement (needed to establish a reliable Battery State of Charge) another high quality IC, the ISL28023 is used.

Current sensor module

This optional module, built around an "Arduino" ATMega168 processor and two ISL28023 current sensors, can be used as a (remote) current sensor for Lead Acid batteries, and/or current sensor for charging sources.

With the addition of this module you can get a complete oversight of what is going on with your powerhouse. You can see what is going in or out of a lead-acid battery, and if you use one sensor for measuring the current coming in from your (solar)chargers, then (with adding or subtracting what is going in or out of the lithium banks) you can also know how much current the ship is using. Of course the BMS master module is doing all the math for you and presenting a nice comprehensible table showing what current is coming in and where it is going to.

In addition it also comes with an output to control via the BMS master module an external load, such as a boiler, fuel polisher, or other stuff that you might want to run automatically depending on the availability of charge current and/or battery state.

Status

The new hardware design is ready. I'm now designing the circuit boards. The software needs to be adapted to the new design, but that is not going to be an awful lot of work.

Within a week or so, I'm going to order a small production batch of PCB's. The samples of this batch will be available for a reduced price, and will be used to test the system in a variety of configurations.

There is a small problem though: due to the popularity rise of EV's, there is a run on high quality BMS-chips, and the factory of the LTC6810 IC's has a lead time of over one year... I could secure a small batch of these IC's for delivery in july, so we will have to wait a few more months and I have to hand assemble them on the boards. I have considered to settle on some other (inferior) IC, but my aim is to make the best BMS possible, so for now I decided to stick to my initial choice.

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Hallo Frans,ik ben zeer geïnteresseerd in de door jouw ontworpen BMS en dan wel de Pro versie. Ik heb momenteel 420 amp loodaccu's en heb 8 cellen Eve 304 besteld. Verder heb ik 1600 watt solar panels.
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Any possibility of a 48v version to manage a bank for powering a propulsion motor (as opposed to just a "house bank")?
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https://www.zwerfcat.nl/en/bms-news.html Project was revived April 2022, according to that blog.
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I’m also very interested in this project but also cautious because of the lack of updates. Maar hé, wel een geweldig project!
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Hello I.m interested on the assemble version of the OHybridBMS. The project you made is great, thanks for the work, really usable
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Hi Frans, did you build this OpenHybridBMS? I want to buy it!
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Hi, I expressed interest in your BMS more than a year ago - maybe 2! I’d be very interested in a 12v version. Please add me to your list. Dank u wel.
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Hi...really useful, and a set up I hope to build into a new UK canal boat soon. However can anyone advise as to how we then monitor the combined battery, ie which do I watch, and how to know when charged (or needs charging). Expecting to use Victron BMV 702 energy display Thanks
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Is there any news with this BMS project? I'm very interested in either buying or building one.
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Goedendag, We zijn erg geïnteresseerd  in de pro-versie van de BMS voor 24 volt. Kun je een indicatie geven wanneer deze leverbaar is en wat deze gaat kosten?
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Is de pro-versie van de BMS beschikbaar? En werkt de hybrid Lithium aanpak zoals verwacht? Ziet er zeer doordacht uit en zou graag zelf willen ervaren.
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Its very iteresting concept. However in my opinion the voltage difference between lead-acid and lithium batteries will cause the lithium battery continiusly charging lead-acid battery. To stop that from happening you need a diode to be placed at the positive terminal of the lead-acid battery.
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No, the voltage of a fully charged lithium battery is less than the voltage needed to charge a lead acid battery. The lead acid battery will very quickly settle on the "float voltage" presented by the lithium battery, and current will stop flowing.
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Please note the depth of discharge graph in the top of the article (red line) shows discharge curve for lifepo4 (13.7V when fully charged) chemistry not traditional Li-Ion (12.6V when fully charged). Li-Ion chemistry has more linear dicharge curve that looks closer to Lead-acid. Therefore the Li-Ion therm in this artical is sort of mental shortcut more then actual chemisrty name.
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When talking about lead acid, does this include Gel and AGM types, they have slightly different charge profiles to typical Lead Acid chemistries, but will they still work in this situation for a hybrid setup?
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Is this a dead project? There's been no update on Github for 2 years and Frans hasn't commented for 6 months.
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Is de pro-versie van de BMS beschikbaar? En werkt de hybrid Lithium aanpak zoals verwacht? Ziet er zeer doordacht uit en zou graag zelf willen ervaren.
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Any chance of you publishing what you have at the moment on GITHUB? This would allow others to peer review, build, and suggest modifications.
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I am very interested in the BMS Pro system. Is this still an active project? The GitHub repository shows no activity for a while.
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There are various FB groups dedicated to electrics on boats/motorhomes and LFP battery installations. Much is said about having to control or replace the alternator as it risks burning out with LFP, even in a hybrid system. I have installed LFP and kept the system as a hybrid by keeping the old LA batteries. You say that the system needs no modification. Can you reassure me! Thank you. Great articles, by the way.
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Very interested in this. When are you going to publish on Github? and any idea of when the Pro will be available and cost yet?
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1 more comment: my LA and Li battery banks each have their own charging source (LA - solar, LI - wind). The plan is to connect both the LA +/- outputs to the single +/- inputs of a substantial DC to AC inverter. Any comments or thoughts?
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I am going to build this. Parallel connection from each battery type to a single inverter. Inverter has + / - terminals and the Lithium + along with the L Acid + to the inverter +, and same with the negatives. This should work as the author describes, I believe. Any comments?
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I'd love to have a go at building your BMS, when you're happy with it would you mind posting the details of how you built it so others can copy it
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We would be interested in purchasing a Pro Unit.
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Is this Open design available to the public for rebuild?
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Also very interested in the BMS Pro system. Please let me know when it is available. Thank's
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Frans, what you say doesn't fit publishedcapacity/voltage curves of LFP batteries. Check this: https://www.solacity.com/how-to-keep-lifepo4-lithium-ion-batteries-happy/ You see in the 2. plot the 12V version with 13V at 40% LFP capacity. If you discharge from, say, 90% to 40% that leaves you with only 50% of the possible 80% LFP capacity. So loweing the discharge cutoff to 12.6V would still leave the LA batt. rather full and deplete LFP to 15%. Much better!
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Hi Frans, thanks for suggesting this simple solution! Why would you want to develop your own BMS? Can't you simply use one that is available like Electrodacus? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrTu9uehOFg you can set the cut-in low voltage separate from the low cut-off voltage, you can set the high cut-off voltage and many more. It also has a battery overtemp protection aswell as an batt undertemp protection (LFP batt should be chared above 5°C only). The starter batt can then float when LFP is full.
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Nice article. 1 remark though about charging. You can FloatCharge CCCV lithium @ < bms-cut-off-voltage till it's saturated at the voltage setpoint. Advantage hereof is that the battery bms never disconnect the (solar)charger. Under floatcharge I mean just charging with one voltage set-point, e.g @ 14.0v for a 12v battery. Good idea or not?
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Very interested in the pro system.
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Your BMS sounds very promising and perfect for our situation. Please add us to your list, and thanks
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I'm very interested in your BMS when you start making them, can you notify me with a price when they're ready
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I’d be interested in the pro system. What price roughly? Thank you.
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Frans Veldman
Sorry, I have no insight yet in the cost of a small production run.
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what happens if say the alternators are pumping out 100amps+ I seem to see 50amps as max charge on most .Lithiums?
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Frans Veldman
My BMS will disconnect the lithium battery if the charge current is too high. Ofcourse it is better to dimension the system in such a way that the charge current is compatible with the lithium batteries.
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So if I fix cables of a size that would restrict current, say 35qm. Would that keep the BMS happy?
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Hi there, enjoying your articles, thanks. Does the alternator voltage need to be adjusted in order to run a hybrid system? I have one boat which has an alternator which outputs 14.4v, and one which outputs 14.8v via an external regulator. Would these be compatible with a hybrid system?
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Frans Veldman
As long as the lithium battery is charging, the voltage will not be able to go up because the lithiums are absorbing all available current. The BMS will disconnect the lithium battery as soon as it is fully charged. After that, the alternators etc can do just their own thing, increasing the voltage to whatever value they want. So the programmed voltage doesn't matter for the lithium battery, as long as it is higher than the voltage of the lithium charge voltage.
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I am very interested in your BMS. You have a very well thought out system but I noticed on GitHub there are no recent postings. Where do you stand on development? Thank you.
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Frans Veldman
I have been unavailable for a while, but I will soon continue the project. I'm in the process of developing the PCB's. The prototype is working fine on our ship!
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Hi Frans - I am very interested in this because I would like to add a LiFePO on my canal boat. It has twin alternators, a 35A for the starter battery (110Ah SLA) and a 70A for "house" batteries (345Ah SLA). My idea is to connect a LiFepO (120Ah) in parallel with the starter battery for charging via a VSR (ie "split-charging") only when the engine is running, via an ignition controlled changeover relay, which then connects the LiFePo in parallel to the house bank when the engine stops. Any comments?
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Frans Veldman
I'm not sure why you would be doing that?
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Nice work, i too have built a Battery Monitoring system based on a Particle Photon and the ADS1115 with voltage dividers, amazed to discover such a similar approach. I push the data out to Thingspeak with a web hook.
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I have been looking for information about using LFP and LA in parallel and happened upon your comment in the DIY Mobile Solar forum. I have just an off-grid cabin, and this is exactly what I have been dreaming about - a hybrid solution for multiple charging sources at 24v, robust and temperature variable (central plains of the USA here). This solves practically all of my issues. Although I am not much of a help with coding I will follow along eagerly. Thanks so much!
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So, when the lithium pack switches off because of low voltage, how does it recognize that it is ok to switch on again? Manually? If you have two circuits (charge and discharge) like usually with LF packs, you will need to redesign a lot.
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This is a good question. I assume that when the charging source raises the LA voltage to an acceptable level for the Lithium BMS to "reopen" for business. Correct?
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Frans Veldman
If the lithium is disconnected, the BMS will continue to monitor the bus voltage. As soon as it rises above the lithium battery voltage, it reconnects the lithium battery to the bus.
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We both seem to have adopted exactly the same approach. I too use esp8266 and wireless connection for everything including remote displays, web interface, remote monitoring, etc etc.i have the hybrid BMS as a stand alone unit that can perform all required protection and control of the battery environment and that communicates via MQTT with a Pi and direct to other esp control units including proportional dump load control and various other power control and optimising systems. I think hybrid rocks!
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Dank je wel voor een zeer interessant artikel!
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Frans, finally someone who sees a hybrid system with the same view! I have been struggling with some of the same questions, even the same thoughts about hardware for a BMS. I would enjoy hearing more as you move forward, and could possibly work on the Pro a bit. I am not an EDA expert, but I have worked with it a bit.
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Frans we zijn zelf bezig met het voorbereiden van een li ion verhaal. Wat ons nog niet duidelijk is, is hoe je omgaat met je alternator. De meeste alternatoren branden door als ze li ion laden zonder dat er een regeling is in functie van de temperatuur ten gevolge van de hoge laadstroom? Hoe vangt jouw systeem dat op? Voor ons is juni 2021 of 2022 de vertrekdatum en hopen we jullie ergens in de pacific nog te ontmoeten. Bert (schip: Evarne)
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Well, for what it's worth: there is not much you can do about the heat dissipation in a 12V alternator. You can switch to a 24V system (half the amperage and heat at the same wattage), get a large frame alt, get an oil cooled alt, get a double fanned alt, lay a vent hose to the back of the alt fan-ventilated. Limit the amperage by an external regulator like Balmart.
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Lädt man die Lions über einen BtoB Ladebooster z.Bsp.BB1260 Sterling brennt die Lima nicht durch da ja nicht mehr als 60A geliefert werden.
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